Interview

Ofer Wolberger in dialogue with Jennifer Crowley

Looking at your œuvre and your education, you seem to be interested in different aspects of art, theoretically and practically. Where does your interest for photography come from and what do you like about this medium?

My interest in photography grew out of my obsession with cinema. I was studying art history, drawing and printmaking in college when I really got interested in film. I added cinema to my studies and discovered that I loved it. At the same time I took my first photography course and realized that photography was a big part of filmmaking as well. I loved photography and decided to pursue it further. I love the surprise and delight of what something looks like once I have photographed it. Although through experience one can have an idea of what a photograph will look like in the end, there is still a strong element of wonder and surprise at looking at a photograph. I also am attracted to the control that the photographic medium can afford, it’s essentially a science in that respect. Also, one of the most amazing characteristics of photography is the multiple meanings and interpretations that can be extracted from or inferred by an image.

What inspired you to start your “Life with Maggie” project?

The idea for the project came from the Mask itself. It’s made of paper and it’s old, probably from the 1930’s or 40’s. It was given to my wife Billie by her parents a few years ago but she had grown up around it and others like it for some time. I saw the mask hanging on the wall at her place in France. I asked about it and where it came from. I was intrigued and she tried it on for me, then we made a photograph. After I had some time to think about the photograph I realized how much I liked it and the many possibilities it could lead to. I definitely wanted to make more. We made a few more around NYC when Billie was here and then I came up with the idea to take this character on a journey. Slowly the details of the project were coming together, but the whole thing was basically set in motion by the mask itself.

Traveling is a crucial aspect of the whole project. The two of you visited different countries and different kinds of sites, more rural and more urban landscapes, also architectures and interior settings are represented in the project. What does traveling mean to you?

Traveling is one of the best parts of the project as a whole. The notion of the journey and what is found and absorbed along the way is a crucial part of the project. Each of us moves through the world in different ways but we all stop and ponder the things that interest us and that make a strong impression. For example, the memorial to James Dean along the side of the road where he stopped to pick up something at a gas station before fatally crashing his car is a perfect example of the type of place that can't help but make a strong impression. We found this monument by chance and immediately realized that Maggie would take a picture there. Embracing the random and exploratory nature of the journey is a critical component of the project. There is also a kind of thread running through the pictures or at least some consistency in terms of the themes. There are many repeated themes that I think help to emphasize the basic human qualities and sense of yearning that Maggie embodies. Examples of repeated themes or motifs that Maggie explores along her journey are pictures by the coasts, vintage cars, modernist architecture, sunsets along the water and the tourist destinations. I would also say that “Life with Maggie” has given me an enormous amount of freedom in that I can basically put Maggie into any situation and make a photograph. She is in essence a license to document and records things that I normally wouldn't be able to bring myself to photograph. In that sense it is very much a dream project.

Would you then say it is you traveling with Maggie or is it Maggie traveling with you?

I’m not exactly sure, but it’s probably more me traveling with Maggie as she determines where to go. I like to think that the photographs are Maggie’s choice, she decides what she wants to remember.

Looking at the pictures' titles, one can figure out, where you have been on your journeys. USA and France are obviously the most represented countries in your photographs, corresponding to your and Billie's origin.

Yes, we decided it would be a great way for us to get to know each other better by exploring our origins and using Maggie as a way to discover where we come from and to show each other.

Do you think you are influencing each others view on the others and also your own country of origin?

As I spend much of my time in New York, I definitely can feel like a foreigner in my own country and traveling around with Billie is a great way to experience things in a new and fresh way. How did you experience the specificity of the landscapes and sites in the countries, exploring them together with Billie and following Maggie's journey? The American and French landscapes couldn't be more different in that the American landscape is more cluttered and is almost stranger in that you never know what you will find. In France the landscape is cleaner and less cluttered, there is more of just pure countryside without interference. In a way, it makes it harder for me to photograph in France as there is less of that "(human) evidence" lying around. But as you can see there were many instances where we found pieces of America while driving around France. The Pink Cadillac being a perfect example.

The project combines elements of portraiture and landscapes, more rural and urban ones. What interests you about these aspects?

About portraits it's the people and the places that surround them what interest me. Landscapes, Interiors and/or Architecture in general interests me in that they allow me to see evidence of our existence on the land. My photographs are never just a perfectly untouched landscape, there is always the human element, although not necessarily a person actually there. I’m very much attracted to places and spaces when I make photographs and in a way it’s the landscape or the architecture that can inspire me to make a picture. But with Maggie, it’s really the combination of her being in the landscape or being surrounded by a place that makes the photograph come alive.

How would you describe the relation of Maggie and our todays reality, also Billie and Maggie, as they are obviously not identical?

Maggie sort of instinctually became what she is and I really liked the idea of this character coming from another time and place and trying to fit in. But the easiest places to fit in are the ones that feel lost in another time, just like she doesn't quite fit in with the world today. I use the vintage wardrobe and “slippery” locations to emphasize that dislocation in time. Billie is portraying the role and character of Maggie, but there are definitely parts of Billie in Maggie. Either way, it's an exceptional performance.

The project also contains some more intimate, interior portraits of Maggie. How would you point out the role of these portraits within the series of “Life with Maggie” as a whole?

I wanted there to be a range of photographs in the series from the more public images to the really intimate moments. This makes Maggie more real and life-like which is important to take away, she's not just a living doll.

To understand better your working process on the photographs: how intensively do you prepare each single photograph? Would you consider them as more staged or spontaneous pictures?

They are actually a perfect combination of both modes of making pictures. Each photograph is spontaneous in that we never know for sure what we will find along the journey and yet it is very much staged in that we have to choose the right outfit for Maggie and figure out where she’ll be in the photo and what she’ll be doing. Each photograph is also different in terms of the selection of locations or settings for Maggie. Sometimes a location or site is chosen simply by instinct and sometimes it’s the cultural context but really it’s a combination of both. Lorraine Motel or James Dean are both perfect examples of places found by chance that both have a very strong cultural context. The idea of finding these significant places by chance is quite interesting to me.

Do you also work on the pictures digitally – if yes, is this an important part of your process of making photographs?

All of the Maggie photographs are staged so I don't really think about this issue very much. The whole thing is set up from the beginning so for me I don’t see the difference of controlling the photo before or after it is shot. But in general some of the photographs are exactly what was there but in others there is a bit of digital work going on. Mostly though it’s about making the color look right and making the photograph feel like it might be from another time.

What about the light in the pictures – is it always the “natural” light of the site, even in the interior photographs?

All the light in the photographs is “natural” light as you say, it's all what is found at the actual location, whether exterior or interior. Light is such an important component of any photographic project but a lot of the time I'm attracted to the light that I see just as much as I am attracted to the location or the moment I'm trying to capture. The light in the picture animates and creates the mystery or atmosphere we see and feel.

To complete my more technical based questions: what kind of camera and dimensions of prints did you chose for the “Life with Maggie” project?

I’m essentially a large format film photographer with a preference for the 8 x 10 inch camera. For this project though, I mostly used a 4 x 5 inch camera as it allowed me more mobility and the option of shooting polaroid and it costs a 1/4 of the price so I could shoot more film. I also used a medium format handheld camera as well for a few of the images that I couldn’t use a tripod for. For my older bodies of work I print fairly large at around 50 x 60 inches, but for the Maggie series I at first wanted the photographs to be much smaller. So I started printing small and set one size at 8 x 10 inches on 11 x 14 inch paper. I was experimenting and made a few other sizes. Because of the large format negative it is quite amazing to blow up the images to a larger size where you can really see all of the details and feel the space within an image. The sense of scale within in the photographs is also important. I ended up making a 16 x 20 inch image printed on 20 x 24 inch paper as well as a 30 x 40 inch image printed on 40 x 50 inch paper. The large photographs are mostly limited to the images where Maggie is smaller in the frame and seen from a distance.

Having a look at your oeuvre, the technique of collage seems to interest you. There also seems to be a connection between your “Collage Portraits” and “Crumpled Paper” portraits to the “Life with Maggie” photographs, apart from the fact, that the mask of Maggie's face is made of paper.

I'm not exactly sure where my interest in collage comes from but I've always been attracted to it. When I was growing up I used to make large scale collages using my mother's home and fashion magazines and I never really thought of it as art or anything, it was just something I did because I enjoyed it and the challenge of putting disparate things together in a single composition. The “Life with Maggie” photographs I see as living collages in the sense that I'm photographing found places and placing a staged element into it. Maggie is the "collaged" element in the landscape. In relation to the “Crumpled Paper” photographs or the “Collage Portraits”, Maggie seems to me to be a further exploration of similar concepts about beauty and identity. I can definitely see Life with Maggie as a synthesis between my collage based work and the kinds of spaces and landscapes in the “Imitation of Life” project.

As you are mentioning the “Imitation of Life” project, where you are photographing our man made environment, landscapes and architectures: what fascinates you about the relationship of man and his living space?

I've always been attracted to the places that man has built for himself. A completely untouched landscape doesn't interest me as much as a landscape that has been scarred by it's use. I like seeing the evidence of human interaction as it begins to tell us a bit about who we are as people. It's kind of like anthropology, the study of humankind as seen through our built environment.

Also other photographers have worked on similar concerns. Are there a few you would point out as being inspiring for you?

There are bodies of work that I respect and might have inspired the project in various ways. Some aren't really work that inspired me but that I realized afterwards was possibly related, like Stephen Shore's “Uncommon Places,” William Eggleston, Joel Sternfeld's “American Prospects”, Walker Evan's “American Photographs,” Ralph Eugene Meatyard's “The Family Album of Lucybelle Crater” and also Edward Weston's “Desert Nudes” and Harry Callahan's photographs of his wife Eleanor.

May I ask you about the future of the project? Do you consider it to be endless?
Have you have already planned, where you are traveling to next?

The project is definitely endless, for now the core project of America and France is coming to a close but the journey can and will continue over time. I am also interested in seeing how the project evolves over time as Billie's body slowly ages yet the mask will continue to stay the same.